Hi everyone. Hannu there's a Momus website http://www.imomus.com/ It contains an interesting article where he took Devoto & his partner to dinner.

Thanks S-G! Read the Dinner With Devoto article and it was very nice. Although it doesn't much help me with the problem what to listen from Momus. He seems to like Devoto though. Oh, and there's another article worth checking out where Momus talks abou Devoto: http://www.indexmagazine.com/int​erviews/momus.shtml

SG- I happened to have passed the interview with someone having dinner with Howard and his partner years ago, even in my most internet lacking days in Sweden. It made me feel, sort of sad. Didn't the interviewer have something wrong with his eye or was it his tooth? I can't seem to find it on that site.. maybe if I look harder. Hannu-interesting interview.. it really hit home with me. Thanx both of you and hello Neike what ever you are up to! :)

Kafkas...Yep..the 'Dinner with Devoto' write-up was from 5 years ago & Momus had something wrong with his eye. http://www.imomus.com/thought140​299.html Hannu..I laughed at that bit about 'staring skull'. Personally I think he looks great.

I understand why exactly it felt sad at the time after reading it again, finaly after all these years. It felt as though it wasn't exactly a fair understanding of Devoto..there is something more frail and emotional about his motives than the surface coolness shows; I feel this was why he distanced himself from the ideas that the interviewer was trying to express.. for example, artist as curator...why should it be that way, I've felt it needs to be more of an effort if it worked out that way; what about the work itself. To say Devoto himself is guilty of the plagiarism by introducing Dostojevskj to a wider audiance..as he doesn't take credit and the plagiarism is far too noticable. It also bothers me when people consider him 'Pretentious', as if it was synomous with 'educated'? I call him well read, like Mark E. Smith.

Just ordered It Only Looks As If It Hurts. All Devoto's lyrics except the ones for Buzzkunst and Mansun. Nice. And the cost wasn't bad either.

Hannu- hope you won't find 'It Only Looks...' offensive:) I got my copy from a book signing but was so embarrased (apart from an interviewer I was the ONLY person looking at the book). I asked HD for the signature & practically ran out of the shop (sorry- I know I've bored Kafkas & Neike with that story before)

Kafkas..re pretentiousness- I think some of the lyrics on Unanswerable Lust do seem a bit that way with mentions of Proust & French words. I can think of many more very pretentious people. Have you seen Momus' poem about Devoto called 'the most important man alive'. http://shotbybothsides.com/mag_t​rib.htm

That being said, he does sing ~I'm no place for pretense or protocol~. ;) Okay, that wasn't all too serious. Thanks for the direct link, there, I've not been to that in a while, it made me chuckle all over again. And I'd really not call your story the type that could get boring all that soon. I do still envy you. ;)

Aaah..yes, I should listen to the words more carefully. Neike...I just did a search here on 'Brighton' & there's an entry on this board from someone who interviewed Howard in the exact record store where the signing was. He says Noko was there. I don't remember anyone else apart from the interviewer & Howard (who looked lovely).

SG- I forgot to say thanx for that too; but back to the idea of pretentiousness and Devoto, Neike pointed out the words, and I myself have always noticed when well read nerds such as myself get to the point where we have the confidence to say eductated things, there are always people coming along to say that it is pretentious.

continued:Its the problem with art and litterature today, to read a great peice of literature such as Proust, or Kafka (have to say it) or Dostojevskj and try to spread that around a bit, is considered pretentious? Looking at a painting (Van Goah for ex) in a museum is also pretentious for want to understand that these things are all created by living breathing fellow humans, who in spite of hardships (and they had massive hardships) still some how glimmer a lasting spark in history, and in spite of the fact that those who actually write the history are the ones who don't like artists and writers and musicans alive.. for they would naturally contradict what has been written about them...understand what I'm getting at? I feel that this exactly is the essence of Devoto, and it can't be pretentious, it just is.

<spam> Whoohoo! I'm back proper! *thuds into bed and sleeps until monday (way to contradict myself!)* </spam>

Yes I see what you mean and think it's great to talk about literature and art in the right setting. It's just one song 'Mlle' that I find annoying at the start with the French words. I get irritated very easily by small things. Grumpy old woman...that's me.

I am just sad that a bit of trying to spread words and art from a hundred years or so has to feel pretentious to the majority. I am person from a very very poor uncultured background. The people in my family who actually had brains travelled, and made livings with practical sciences, for example engineering, so art was not thought about, litterature was a waste of time, but music was something different because my mother was a dancer, music became an entrance way to art and litterature. I can't speak french, so I felt that the words in french were more of a sound composition, a kind of texture or back drop; the words are translated on the album though, so not annoying for me.. just a part of it. I used this song for a school project, which is a video. I'd love to get permission to legally use the song so I can load my video onto my website one day...how do I go about doing that???

Hey- I used the B.side of Rainy Season for a student project too. We were making tape-slides all those years ago (no video at my college). Maybe you can contact the other half of Luxuria via their management re. permission to use the music?

Well, FiSONIC has a pretty good connection to Noko, so maybe he can harrass the poor fellow about it. Hmm, FiSO', would you do that? *prods him*

How do we know Neike is the same person as Neike, and FiSONIC is always FiSONIC...? --- As for using songs, I think the only way to officially obtain a license to use a recording is via the publisher (which should be found in the small print of the record - and formally usually isn't the artist isself, afaik). Sometimes national royalty collection societies might be able to give licenses as well, I think (like MCPS, BIEM, STEMRA, ASCAP, GEMA or whatever... http://www.riaa.com/issues/licen​sing/howto.asp)

@OTB: No, I don't think I'm either sad or bored enough to talk to myself. Jealous of the activity here after you were so sure everyone would stop posting after you left? ;) And - how do you know, you ask? You can ask for phonenumbers and check it out yourself, which should be no problem, given how much time you seem to have on your hands. *eyeroll*

Sorry for taking the discussion back a few days, but Hannu wrote (ref:#30647): '''God’s gone back to heaven / he has deserted us / but what the hell / he never understood us anyway''. I happen to be a born-again christian and this piece of music is just so arrogant against God.' - Well, I think this piece of lyrics is actually endowed with understanding for god. OK, I am being slightly mischievous here. But isn't the whole concept of god very arrogant? And isn't being arrogance a fair 'weapon' against arrogance? (I'm not saying that it's an effective 'weapon'. (Apparently it failed on you... But I'm sorry, I got a bit mischievous again. I am actually pretty tolerant, and let me assure you, I have nothing against you being a born-again christian. Honestly.))

On a different note: I always found Music is also about Music - I mean the _sound_ of things. That includes the sound of the lyrics as they are sung (and the emotions they conjure, bypassing the brain). So I think you can always like a song, even if you dislike the meaning of the lyrics. Yet certainly, 'good' lyrics add a lot to a song!

Si wrote (ref:#30679): 'there's plenty of good bands around these days' - [plug] JAMES MAKER AND NOKO 440 - http://www.geocities.com/jamesma​ker [/plug]

Openmind (and your imaginary mates) I'm one person. I've met Neike, if only briefly. She's one person too :) You missed a MAGAZINE T-SHIRT on E-Bay. White in colour with black SBBS cover. Goes up to XL. They might sell them here. http://www.knowyourproduct.co.uk​

This might be a silly question but does anyone know any bands/artists that are similar to Magazine? My current favorite is The Chameleons who, in my opinion, are there in the same league with Magazine.

@FiSONIC: Calling the concept of god arrogant seems to me a bit like someone pointing out the love of your life is in the relationship for their own gain, only. ;) It may or may not be true, but fact is, it's hurtful. That being said, I know you well enough to know that was not the intention. And, further, I do think the first two lines that are quoted are perfectly fine - it's the last two that strike a nerve. (Just for clarification for those of you who are starting to doubt: Yeah, I'm an atheist. :D) And of course I totally agree about the 'feeling' of vocals and music. Paticularily with Luxuria. :)

@FiSONIC²: Well, I wouldn't quote James in response to a '-plenty- of good bands'. He's too unique for that, IMO. :) @Hannu: The only band I ever found sounding similar to Magazine (beware, I listen to few other bands but those people know I listen to) is Tad Williams' school band 'Idiot'. They did a few pretty cool tracks, surprisingly. Other than that, I can't help. And even the reference I gave is dodgy at best - however, it'd have the gain of me being able to link you to mp3s. *grin*

@S-G: <OTB impression> surely you were only looking at your reflection!! </OTB impression> Maybe he wants to know how many people he has to assasinate to be able to 'reclaim' this forum. ::)

Neike, I didn't understand what you were saying about god, arrogance and love.

I've seen Franz Ferdinand live & have their latest CD but think they're NOTHING like Magazine in any way. They remind me of a lot of early 80's bands but not Magazine. Can't think who does sound like them.

Neike- Maybe OTB/Openmind is influenced by that song on Beast Box called 'Animal in the Mirror'. Maybe he's now back as ff???

Oh, I do understand Neike's comment about god, arrogance and love now. And yes, you are right: Both statements are the kind of truths, that people don't like to hear. (And I don't want to condemn people for that.) I'm sorry if you feel insulted by my mischievousness, Hannu. That wasn't my intention.

I think listening to Franz Ferdinand is fun (regardless of what they can be compared to, or what not - if at all).

Don't laugh but I think that early Simple Minds (from late '70's) sounded a bit like Magazine. I saw them (Simple Minds) by accident (honestly) in 1979 & Jim Kerr even moved like HD on stage. They also toured with Magazine that year.

To FISONIC! Can you give me a link to MP3's by the Idiot? Did I understand you correctly? I'd be interested.

Hi Hannu, I think it's _Neike_ who might have a link to MP3s of Tad Williams' band 'Idiot'. Maybe you should email her.

SG- we must be on the same wavelenght, due to the fact I had a major major Simple Minds dream happening last night... it was odd because I used to have such a crush on Jim Kerr, about the same time as my massive Pete Shelley crush.. lol..it went away when I saw a music paper with the wedding photos of Jim Kerr and Chrissy Hyde(?)I was all 15 at the time..yeah I see the connection though, I was just going to say that so I won't laugh..

How do we know Neike I always found Music is also about Music if only briefly I'm one person but think they're NOTHING like looking at your reflection..it went away when I saw a music connection though the Idiot - I am actually pretty, I have nothing against you being an effective 'weapon'

Kafkas- That's synchronicty for ya.

@Hannu: I sent you the link to a website where you can get them. Note that they're free for distribution. Also, I've just downloaded the rest I hadn't heard yet (that's about half of them ;) ). They're annoyingly diverse. ;) lol But I do like them, regardless. Anyway, about two or three songs reminded me of M'zine. Now to find which ones those were.

I'm soon to be the owner of Beast Box again.I remembered there was a song on it called Smoking Mirror. Very interesting. http://www.smokinmirrors.net/tez​catli/tezcatli.html

@S-G: Oh, man. Just when I thought Devoto had nothing to do with the Aztecs. Gah. Why does it keep haunting me? (Translated: Thanks for the link. n_n Definitely interesting!)

he had the same producer as Aztec Camera - john brand does r'head's 'creep' sound like the end of 'burst'?

Hi, Hannu. just looked through the forum lines and noted your quite appropriate question. well i'd say that nonetheless magazine was a unique band with the unique music there were bands that sounded pretty similar. i'd like to mention three early Ultravox albums (those with John Foxx), 'Fade to grey' by Visage, 'Fine art of surfacing' by The Boomtown Rats...er, of course there are some others, but i can't get my brains together to refresh my wastebin memory. maybe later...

flux. yes, creep / burst. (also 'he ain't heavy he's my..' kind of thing) ps. flux is not a creation of OTB productions. tho i did have to think for a while to be sure.

Neike @ on 00:38 31st-Aug-04 GMT [www.pinkgothic.com/luxuria/] ref:#30785 @S-G: <OTB impression> surely you were only looking at your reflection!! </OTB impression> Maybe he wants to know how many people he has to assasinate to be able to 'reclaim' this forum. ::) is this appropriate? Have i deserved this sort of comment..

http://matula.hu/subbacultcha/pl​aylist/index.php?x=20040514&y=1 ...for a live version of Rainy Season ...devoto once said you couldn't walk into a shop the same way that you walk on stage...although i once witnessed the singer from the Rolling Stones absailing into his local delicatessen

@flux: Neat! Thanks for the link. I'm quite enjoying the Winamp style webdesign, too. (Though I rarely use Winamp, myself) @open mind: Obviously I think it's appropriate, or I wouldn't have posted it. I won't ask you if you find it appropriate to accuse me of cloning, either, for the same reason. For someone who declared his leavetaking, you sure post a lot.

I know I am naive, but can't there be just peace on earth? Everyone has their own likes and dislikes. And this is a public place after all.

fisonic; sounds good, peace is the way. flux,are you who i think you are? (nieke and gang; not me i assure u).

ps, peacefully, nieke, it was OTB who said bye. now lets get back to the real issues...who is flux....?